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++++Message 3803. . . . . . . . . . . . Re: Bob P.

From: Mark Everett . . . . . . . . . . . . 10/25/2006 8:21:00 AM


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From the 1969 General Service Conference Report
"Robert P_______ ... was elected to the General Service Board in July

1968.


He had his last drink in 1961. He is a director of the Grapevine Corporate

Board, as well as of A. A. W. S., Inc. He was chairman of the Public

Information Committee of the New York Intergroup and is a former president

of the Fairfield County (Conn.) Council on Alcoholism. He is an executive

with Shell Oil Company."
Just to learn a bit more about one

of our trusted servants.


**************************************************

Mark Everett

517 Cherry Hill Lane

Lebanon, Ohio 45036-7608

Phone: (513) 228-0078

Cell: (513) 850-4911

eFax: (267) 851-2083

e-mail: mark@go-concepts.com

**************************************************
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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++++Message 3804. . . . . . . . . . . . Bill W. and Dr. Bob Play in NYC

From: Bill Lash . . . . . . . . . . . . 10/25/2006 8:27:00 AM


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http://www.billwanddrbob.com/index.htm
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++++Message 3805. . . . . . . . . . . . Re: Bob P.

From: Wendi Turner . . . . . . . . . . . . 10/24/2006 1:01:00 PM


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Is there an email address for Bob or his familly,

some place to send a card and/or email well wishes???


----- Original Message -----

From: Carter Elliott

To: AAHistoryLovers@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Monday, October 23, 2006 8:14 PM

Subject: [AAHistoryLovers] Bob P.
Friends of Bob Pearson, former trustee and GSO

"many things," will be happy to know he's

recovering from a stroke (which he had two weeks

ago) at his Idaho home.


Carter E.
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++++Message 3806. . . . . . . . . . . . Help with historic New York City AA

photos


From: Al Welch . . . . . . . . . . . . 10/25/2006 10:18:00 AM
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Looking for photos of buildings of A.A. interest

in the New York City area for the following page:


http://www.a-1associates.com/aa/historic%20sites.htm
For the following buildings:
Calvary Church/House 21st and Park Ave

30 Vesey Street

415 Lexington Ave.

141 E. 44th Street

315 E 45th Street

468 Park Avenue

38 Livingstonm St
Thanks for any help!
Al Welch welch@a-1associates.com

(welch at a-1associates.com)


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++++Message 3807. . . . . . . . . . . . Re: Online and web-paged groups

From: t . . . . . . . . . . . . 10/25/2006 11:27:00 PM


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In about 1996 or so I put up a schedule for the

Show Me group in Denton, Texas. It was just one page

with the schedule and 'how to find us' info. I had

links to it from an AA history site I had up at the

time. I didn't have links back to my site on that

individual page, but the viewers could easily use the

BACK button on their browser unless they went there

directly from a saved bookmark.


Several other groups already had sites up, with

schedules and basic AA info by then. My experience at

the time was that most of them were put up by

individual members rather than by groups themselves.

I brought my own up at a group conscience meeting

[after it was already up], and the basic reaction

was 'go ahead' with no real discussion. At that time,

few at my local group had been exposed to computers

and the internet.
As some of those sites began to introduce more

information [some from GSO and some from other sources],

along with personal experiences/opinions ... well

then some were discussed at the group conscience and

'talked to'.
Some members and groups had problems with their

schedules being on the Free sites [Geocities for one]

that pasted random ads on the pages.
The person who began posting my homegroups schedule

after I quit ... well he was 'talked to' about having

it branch off of, and link back to, his daughters

Brittney Spears pages. Later he was again 'talked to'

about anonymity, when he started posting announcements

and snippets from our business and group conscience

meetings along with the group's phone list.
__________________________________
Ernest Kurtz wrote:
"As I continue to sort through the early history of

AAs online and online AA, I have come across the

claim that 'the West Baltimore group [was] the first

home group with a page on the internet. We went up

on June 26, 1994.' Any challengers out there? And

if Al's claim is accurate, who was second? And when?

And, perhaps, why?"
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++++Message 3808. . . . . . . . . . . . Re: City Sequence of AA Growth

From: Glenn Chesnut . . . . . . . . . . . . 10/28/2006 10:30:00 PM


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Tom E. = ny-aa@att.net (ny-aa at att.net) posted

a message asking: "Does anyone have a list of

when Alcoholics Anonymous groups were started on

a city-by-city basis?"


We have had people write in, telling us the date

at which the first AA meeting was started in specific

cities like Bisbie, Arizona, and Marion, Ohio. This

doesn't help though, because this isn't a list showing

how AA grew and spread in that part of the country.
What Tom was looking for was an organized list which

would give the dates of the first AA group formed for

hundreds and hundreds of cities, so he could compare

the dates.


To the best of my knowledge, there is at present

no list of this sort for the entire U.S. and Canada

which would take us down to 1945 and afterwards. And

certainly no list of groups listed in chronological

order which would take us down to 1960 or later.
It seems to me that the only practical way to

assemble such a list would be to begin by gathering

information on individual cities and communities on

a state-by-state basis.


For the early period, I have been assembling that

kind of information for the state of Indiana:

http://hindsfoot.org/nhome.html
This list is not complete, and we are still gathering

information. It is clear however that there were

three axes of growth in early Indiana AA.
One axis extended from Evansville in the SW to

Indianapolis in the center to Fort Wayne in the NE.

Most of the rest of the AA groups in the state grew

off of this axis. In particular, John D. "J. D."

Holmes (the tenth person to get sober in AA) in

Evansville and Doherty Sheerin in Indianapolis were

in continual telephone contact, and had it organized

so that J. D. would travel by car or train every

weekend to help get AA groups started and distribute

AA literature throughout much of the state.


Another totally separate axis ran along the St. Joseph

river valley, in north central Indiana and southwestern

Michigan. This produced a number of AA leaders (like

Brownie and Nick Kowalski) who are still remembered to

this day. AA groups from surrounding states make

pilgrimages to South Bend every year to honor the memory

of Brownie and Nick in particular.
A third axis ran from Chicago through Gary to South

Bend. The early black AA leaders along that axis were

in continual contact with one another, and helped black

AA groups grow. This is still true to this day. A

number of Indiana AA's finest leaders have come from

cities along that axis.


I believe that this is the kind of information and

analysis that Tom E. is looking for. I am hoping that

we will be able to fill in more detail during the

years ahead, but it takes a number of people all over

a state to produce a state history. One person cannot

do it alone.


Glenn C. (South Bend, Indiana)
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++++Message 3809. . . . . . . . . . . . Re: Science of Mind, New Thought,

and AA


From: LES COLE . . . . . . . . . . . . 10/26/2006 1:15:00 PM
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Hi All: On this subject, I suggest that the old book

VARIETIES OF RELIGEOUS EXPERIENCES by Wm. James might

interest you. I am reading it for the first time based

on the knowledge that this is the book given to Bill

Wilson (by Ebby Thacher) when Bill was in Towns Hospital

prior to his "flash" experience. Reportedly, Bill had

a lot of interest in this book.
It is very "heady" reading but full of beautiful prose,

and deep and comprehensive interpretations. Although

first written by James for lectures at Edinburgh

University back in 1902-3 period, his thoughts are

very profound and meaningful today. His review

(connections) between major theological/psycholgical

beliefs is very challenging and interesting.
I can see how many things of which James wrote, could

have influenced Bill Wilson in prepaing the AA philosophy

and "Big Book".
It is also interesting that James was raised in a

family which related to (practiced) the Swedenborg

type of religion. That is identified in the

Introduction to the VARIETIES... book. Lois Wilson's

family was also raised in the same a relgious

atmosphere. As history buffs, these old facts

have interesting relationships.
Regards to all on this web,
Les Cole

Colorado Springs, CO


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++++Message 3810. . . . . . . . . . . . What are the Warranties?

From: man_dred . . . . . . . . . . . . 10/26/2006 5:22:00 PM


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What are the six warranties?
FROM THE MODERATOR:
I believe that you are referring to one of the

Twelve Concepts for World Service which are printed

as part of the AA Service Manual. I'm counting

seven of them instead of six. Someone please

let me know if I've got this wrong!
In the 2004-2005 edition, Concept Twelve says:
General Warranties of the Conference:
[1] in all its proceedings, the General Service

Conference shall observe the spirit of the A.A.

Tradition, taking great care that the Conference

never becomes the seat of perilous wealth or power;


[2] that sufficient operating funds, plus an ample

reserve, be its prudent financial principle;


[3] that none of the Conference Members shall ever

be placed in a position of unqualified authority

over any of the others;
[4] that all important decisions be reached by

discussion vote, and, whenever possible, by

substantial unanimity;
[5] that no Conference action ever be personally

punitive or an incitement to public controversy;


[6] that though the Conference may act for the

service of Alcoholics Anonymous, it shall never

perform any acts of government;
[7] and that, like the Society of Alcoholics

Anonymous which it serves, the Conference itself

will always remain democratic in thought and

action.
Glenn C. (South Bend, Indiana)


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++++Message 3811. . . . . . . . . . . . Death of Charles B.

From: Shakey1aa@aol.com . . . . . . . . . . . . 10/28/2006 6:56:00 PM


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My sponsor,Harry The Wino,called me this afternoon

and told me about the death of a man he knew quite

well in A.A.
That man was Charles B. from Miami, Florida, and

Columbus, Georgia. He was 92 and was going to celebrate

49 years of continuous sobriety on January 4th.
He was a close friend to our co-founder Bill W.

If you read pg. 399 of "Pass It On" you will have

known about the man who had Bill flown to Miami in

1970 in his private chartered plane. That man was

Charles.
Bill stayed at the Miami Heart Institute which was

run by Charles' son, and was under the care of

Dr. Ed B., an A. A. member and cardiac surgeon.
Mr B. leaves a spouse Julia who told Harry that she

still has her husband's Big Red with Bill's signature

and that she will treasure it always.
Charles was another A. A. success story. Not just

for staying sober or becoming a success in the

business world, but rather for being a good husband

and father and for carrying the message to others.


Isn't that the best thing that can be said of any

alcoholic!


My prayers go out to his family and friends and

I will post more information as soon as it is

available.
Yours in Service,

Shakey Mike Gwirtz


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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++++Message 3812. . . . . . . . . . . . Who were Jim and Eddie the atheists?

From: dave redman . . . . . . . . . . . . 10/26/2006 5:44:00 PM


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Could someone please tell me who Jimmy or maybe

Eddie the atheist was.


Thank you Dave
- - -
FROM THE MODERATOR:
If you go to the AAHistoryLovers Message Board,

you can do searches for questions like this one.

You just put in the words "Eddie" and "atheist"

(or whatever) and ask it to search for messages

containing both of those words.
Some of the relevant past messages that I found

this way were:


See Message #3167
For the addition of God "as we understood Him" in

the Twelve Steps both Jim Burwell and Hank Parkhurst

(his story "The Unbeliever" appeared in the 1st ed.)

are credited with being the primary influence ("AA

Comes of Age" pgs 166-167). Both claimed to be atheists

at the time.


See also Message #3687
One of the earliest members of the first New York

AA group, Jimmy Burwell was also its first "self-

proclaimed atheist."
Message #2337
Two alcoholics in Akron, Ohio, unsuccessfully preceded

Bill Dotson for the opportunity to be AA #3: the first

was a Dr McKay, the second was Eddie Reilly.
Jun 11 (more likely Jun 18), Dr Bob suggested that he

and Bill W work with other alcoholics. A local Minister,

J C Wright, provided them with a prospect. They tried

in vain, throughout the summer, to sober up Edgar (Eddie)

Reilly (described as an "alcoholic atheist" and "able

to produce a major crisis of some sort about every other

day"). Eddie missed the chance to be AA #3 but he showed

up at Dr Bob's funeral in 1950. He was sober a year and

attending the Youngstown, Ohio, group.
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++++Message 3813. . . . . . . . . . . . Re: What are the Warranties?

From: Shakey1aa@aol.com . . . . . . . . . . . . 10/28/2006 7:58:00 PM


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Glenn there are 6 warranties -- your warranty 6 and 7

are actually the 6th warranty.


Shakey Mike
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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++++Message 3814. . . . . . . . . . . . The Oxford Group and alcoholics

From: Ernest Kurtz . . . . . . . . . . . . 10/29/2006 1:47:00 PM


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An article by J.R. Rees published in the British Journal of Inebriety in

1933 observed concerning alcoholics that "persuasion is not an

effective

method of treatment, but sudden and marked emotional experience seems to

work," continuing: "The Oxford Group Movement, which is much to

the fore


at the present moment, is apparently achieving somewhat similar

results."


Questions:
1. Did Dr. Jung recommend the OG to Roland H., or did Roland find and

choose it on his own (or on someone else's recommendation)?


2. What sources treat directly of the OG's work with alcoholics?
Thanks to any who can shed light on these or related questions.
ernie kurtz
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++++Message 3815. . . . . . . . . . . . FW: What are the Warranties?

From: Art Sheehan . . . . . . . . . . . . 10/30/2006 12:24:00 PM


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Corrected version (for typos)
Hi Glenn
You're getting ahead of the timeline sequence for the origin of the

Warranties and their eventual incorporation into Concept 12. The

Warranties preceded the Twelve Concepts for World Service by 7 years.
The Warranties are 6 provisions of Article 12 of the Permanent

Conference Charter which was approved by the 1955 General Service

Conference subject to further approval by the historic 2nd

International Convention in St Louis, MO (the "AA Comes of Age"

Convention). The Convention approved the Permanent Conference Charter

by resolution on July 3, 1955.


Article 12 of the Permanent Conference Charter is a special provision

compared to the other 11 articles. It was specified to ensure that the

Conference would always function in the spirit of the 12 Traditions.
The individual Warrantees are denoted by their ending with a semicolon

and are not explicitly numbered. At times though they are referenced

relative to their numerical order. For example "The AA Group"

pamphlet


in answering the hypothetical question "What is an AA Group?"

partially answers the question with the statement "Further

clarification of an AA group may be found in Warranty Six, Twelfth

Concept."


The Conference can change Articles 1 thru 11 of the Permanent

Conference Charter by advisory action. But any change to Article 12

(the 6 Warranties) requires special action based on both the

resolution under which the Permanent Conference Charter was approved

by the 2nd International Convention, as well as amendments to Article

3 of the Permanent Conference Charter over the years. Conference

advisory actions of 1957, 1969 and 1976 amended Article 3 so that it

currently reads:


"3. Conference Relation to AA: The Conference will act for AA in the

perpetuation and guidance of its world services, and it will also be

the vehicle by which the AA movement can express its view upon all

matters of vital AA policy and all hazardous deviations from AA

Tradition. Delegates should be free to vote as their conscience

dictates; they should also be free to decide what questions should be

taken to the group level, whether for information, discussion, or

their own direct instruction.


But no change in Article 12 of the Charter or in the Twelve Traditions

of AA or in the Twelve Steps of AA may be made with less than the

written consent of three-quarters of the AA groups, as described in

the Resolution adopted by the 1955 Conference and Convention.*


Footnote * This applies to the original English version only."
The Resolution adopted by the 2nd International Convention has a

provision stating:


"AND IT IS UNDERSTOOD: That neither the Twelve Traditions of

Alcoholics Anonymous nor the warranties of Article XII of the

Conference Charter shall ever be changed or amended by the General

Service Conference except by first asking the consent of the

registered AA groups of the world. [This would include all AA groups

known to the general service offices around the world.] * These groups

shall be suitably notified of any proposal for change and shall be

allowed no less than six months for consideration thereof. And before

any such Conference action can be taken, there must first be received

in writing within the time allotted the consent of at least

three-quarters of all those registered groups who respond to such

proposal.


Footnote * Resolution: It was resolved by the 1976 General Service

Conference that those instruments requiring consent of three-quarters

of the responding groups for change or amendment would include the

Twelve Steps of AA, should any such change or amendment ever be

proposed."
Article 12 of the Permanent Conference Charter is also include in its

entirety in the Resolution.


The Warranties were used to define Concept 12 in its long form. The

long form of the Concepts, and explanatory essays, were approved by

the 1962 Conference when Bill W's manuscript "The Twelve

Concepts for

World Service" was approved for publication. The short form of the

Concepts was approved 9 years later by the 1971 Conference. Concept 12

in its short form does not contain the leading qualifier phrase

"General Warranties of the Conference." Concept 12 in its long

form

and Article 12 of the Permanent Conference Charter read:


"General Warranties of the Conference: in all its proceedings, the

General Service Conference shall observe the spirit of the AA

Tradition, taking great care that the Conference never becomes the

seat of perilous wealth or power; that sufficient operating funds,

plus an ample reserve, be its prudent financial principle; that none

of the Conference Members shall ever be placed in a position of

unqualified authority over any of the others; that all important

decisions be reached by discussion, vote, and, whenever possible, by

substantial unanimity; that no Conference action ever be personally

punitive or an incitement to public controversy;

that, though the Conference may act for the service of Alcoholics

Anonymous, it shall never perform any acts of government; and that,

like the Society of Alcoholics Anonymous which it serves, the

Conference itself will always remain democratic in thought and

action."
If you substitute the words "AA group" or "AA

member" wherever it

refers to the General Service Conference in the Warranties/Concept 12,

it provides a magnificent guideline for each group and each member to




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